“One year has passed since we built a museum in our mold factory” Takako Kajikawa, Part2
Table of Contents
Part1
●Greetings and introduction of performers
●Factory Art Museum Toyama’s first anniversary event
●How did you start attending zenschool and how did you meet enmono?
●About zenschool Toyama and zenschool masters
Part2
●The future of Factory Art Museum Toyama
●Cooperation with Toyama’s manufacturing industry and lectures
●The future of manufacturing and the role of zenschool masters
●Mrs. Kajikawa’s thoughts on “the future of XX in Japan
●Video of the dialogue
This article was published in 2018 This is a conversation that took place in 2006. Please note that the information is current at the time.
●The future of Factory Art Museum Toyama
Miki: Could you tell us about your thoughts on how you would like Factory Art Museum Toyama to change in the future?
Utsunomiya: Has anything happened in the one full year since the opening on April 8 last year (2017)? I mean, has there been any change with this…
Kajikawa: Yes, it has. Now that it’s here, I’ve been getting requests for interviews and tour courses…
Utsunomiya: Have you been interviewed that often?
Kajikawa: We get a few interviews now and then. Regularly.
Utsunomiya: Are they from your hometown?
Kajikawa: Most of them are local. We have received requests for TV specials on manufacturing, small half-hour programs, industrial tourism courses offered by prefectures and cities, as well as visits from “Jalan” and “Rurubu” magazines. Miki: We welcome such coverage.
Miki: You welcome that kind of coverage, don’t you?
Kajikawa: Basically, yes. As long as there is nothing out of the ordinary.
Utsunomiya: Is the change that media coverage and people from outside are starting to come? The place used to be a storage room…
Kajikawa: It used to be a storage room. I come here only once a year or so.
Miki: What do you want this place to be like?
Kajikawa: There are still some things I’m not sure about, but eventually I’d like to increase the number of our products and our works, so that our company’s products can be made on a regular basis.
Miki: But that’s already happening, isn’t it?
Kajikawa: It is happening.
Miki: Do you hope it will accelerate further?
Kajikawa: I’d like to see it accelerate, or if I can play a tune not in Japan, but somewhere far away overseas, and then say, “Actually, this is Toyama,” I’d like to create another hot topic.
Miki: What do you mean by “pop” in the media over there?
Kajikawa: I don’t know if it’s the media or if it’s selling products, but anyway, information is sent out from the outside. The information is sent out from overseas, from far away.
Utsunomiya: You mentioned something yesterday, didn’t you? Didn’t you say yesterday that you had a chance to get to know people who are active in the arts overseas?
Kajikawa: That’s right. You meet people in places you don’t expect to meet, in places you don’t expect to go. Unexpectedly.
Miki: If you go there thinking, “Okay, I’m going to get something,” you’ll end up at ……
Kajikawa: It’s a bit of a mockery, but there are times when you attend a show and the person next to you happens to be an artist like that.
Miki: It does happen. Were you in Kyoto the other day? At a mini-theater?
Kajikawa: Yes, I was. I went to a mini-theater in a little townhouse in Kyoto, and there was a Japanese person living in New York, and he told me that he was going to talk to someone from Toyama tomorrow.
Miki: It would be great if such connections could be made more and more.
Kajikawa: That’s right. He himself said that he wanted to reimport the goodness of Japan and transmit Japanese culture and traditions from New York.
Miki: Do you think you could collaborate on something?
Kajikawa: I’m not sure yet. We’re just getting started.
Miki: By connecting with people overseas in this way, you can attract attention from overseas…
Kajikawa: Yes, that’s right. It’s a reverse import pattern.
Miki: That’s what we at zenschool are aiming for.
Kajikawa: That’s right. If we get more recognition from overseas, we’ll be surprised. What?
Miki: Have there been any visitors from overseas?
Kajikawa: There aren’t any at the moment. That’s as it should be.
Miki: But I’m sure there will be a flow of visitors, so do you have a website in English?
Kajikawa: No, not yet.
Miki: It would be better to have an English page. Also, if there is a curator who can guide visitors in English, that would be even better…
Kajikawa: That would be even better. Why don’t I do that? I’m just saying.
●Cooperation with Toyama’s manufacturing industry and lectures
Miki: Your dream is to connect with people overseas, but do you have any other ideas about how you would like the manufacturing industry in Toyama Prefecture to support your efforts? Not only in this area, but also in other areas such as Takapoke, right? Do you want to collaborate with them?
Kajikawa: That’s right. There is still a “hatena” mark on the product, isn’t there? In the manufacturing industry.
Miki: This initiative?
Kajikawa: Yes, yes. This initiative is probably the one that everyone is glancing at like this and thinking, “They’re doing something. But what is it? I don’t know what they’re doing.
Miki: You’ve been giving lectures in many places, haven’t you?
Kajikawa: Yes, I do. A few at the Chamber of Commerce and Industry.
Miki: What has been the response to your lectures so far?
Kajikawa: They’ve been split down the middle. Some say they didn’t understand it at all, while others say it was very interesting…
Miki: Does it depend on the characteristics of the audience?
Kajikawa: Yes, it does. For example, if you are talking to business owners at a chamber of commerce and industry, if you talk about crowdfunding or recruiting on the Internet, the older people will not understand. But young people in their 30s and 40s are interested in it. I think there are a lot of people who want to do something, but don’t know what to do.
Miki: I also think it would be good to let students know about this project. Like engineering colleges.
Kajikawa: Students? Do you know them?
Miki: I think it’s getting harder and harder for kids in technical colleges to see the direction they want to go in, like manufacturing. Even if they don’t make anything, I think it is meaningful to provide such a space or to convey the idea of manufacturing. Or something like that.
Kajikawa: That’s a good idea.
Miki: I think there are various paths, such as becoming an art curator specializing in manufacturing. I don’t want to put myself in the category of manufacturing, but by talking about your work, I can see that there are many possibilities…
Kajikawa: Will this be helpful?
Miki: I think it will definitely be helpful.
Utsunomiya: I think it would be better to expand the scope of the university’s engineering department.
Miki: For example, at the University of Toyama, the Faculty of Business Administration, the Department of Mechanical Engineering…
Kajikawa: That’s right.
Utsunomiya: I think it would be better if engineers could learn more about management, design, art, philosophy, and so on.
Kajikawa: It would be better to have such things.
Utsunomiya: As technology continues to evolve, machines will also change.
Miki: I would like to ask you to hold a workshop here or some other activity to show that artistic and design sensibilities are important for the future of manufacturing.
Utsunomiya: You could invite people to the philosophy café.
Kajikawa: That sounds good.
Miki: Why don’t you invite (designer) Hiroaki Nishimura to do something like that?
Kajikawa: Mr. Nishimura is amazing, isn’t he?
Miki: This (the chair) was designed by Mr. Nishimura.
●The future of manufacturing and the role of zenschool masters
Miki: Manufacturing, or business itself, is changing very quickly, and I think it will become even faster as AI evolves. At that time, the value that humans should have is sensitivity, isn’t it?
Kajikawa: That’s right.
Utsunomiya: The theme of next week’s Philosophy Café is something like that, isn’t it, how to interact with AI?
Kajikawa: That’s right. Is there a job or not?
Miki: I’m pushing for the sensitivity that humans will have in the future, and also “dialogue” as a keyword, and what we do at zenschool is “dialogue. What we do at zenschool is “dialogue.” It’s a dialogue between us and the students, or between the students themselves. If someone says, “Isn’t this the way it is?” gently, they realize, “Oh, that’s right,” and something comes out of that.
Kajikawa: But it’s not easy for people to say, “Oh, that’s right. “Kajikawa: But it’s hard to get people to listen and say, “Oh, that’s right.
Miki: If you create a place where people can say anything to each other in a safe space with enough team building, you won’t have many people saying, “That’s not true.
Utsunomiya: First of all, a sense of security is necessary. Some people can’t let their guard down. I’m sure you have witnessed people who are afraid of exposing themselves.
Kajikawa: Like they can’t take off their masks?
Utsunomiya: They don’t realize it. They are unconscious about wearing the mask. There is a chance to take off the mask when something is wrong or when you are bothered by it, but there are many people in the world who push it so deep into their unconscious that they don’t even notice it. That doesn’t work very well, so without the help of alcohol or drugs or anything…
Kajikawa: That’s right. When I drink alcohol, I ask more questions at once.
Utsunomiya: I think the power of dialogue is that you can do it sober, and dialogue is cheaper than alcohol.
Kajikawa: But it takes a lot of effort to prepare for a dialogue, doesn’t it?
Utsunomiya: That’s probably not a dialogue. It’s just a kind of dialogue.
Miki: That’s why it is important to have a person who can create a place. The way of the person who creates the place is important, because it is difficult to put into procedure, but the atmosphere of the person creates the place. I think it is important for the person who creates such a place to be a facilitator, which will be the future of facilitation.
Utsunomiya: It is about the environment. The way of dialogue will be different if it is in nature, in a tree, or around a bonfire, or if the situation is set up with something other than alcohol.
Miki: It’s the way of the person asking the questions, isn’t it?
Kajikawa: How to ask questions is quite difficult.
Utsunomiya: I think it can be improved by training. I don’t think it can be done unconsciously. Some training is necessary.
Miki: That’s why it’s better for people who are not involved in the project to do it.
Utsunomiya: I think it would be better for non-manufacturers to address manufacturers…
Miki: I asked the employees of Fujita Corporation if they would like us to create a space for them rather than Mr. Kajikawa to do it. We’re not involved in the project at all, so we don’t have a stake in it, and we can’t be rude to people who come from outside.
Kajikawa: I’m sure you’re right. I’m sure you’re right.
Miki: We are professionals in dialogue, so please leave it to us. If you have a company where communication is not going well between employees or between the president and employees, leave it to the professionals who can create a place for it.
Everyone: (laughs)
Miki: If you create such a place, communication will improve, or perhaps a new business idea will be born from it.
Kajikawa: It doesn’t go to that level, does it?
Utsunomiya: But new ideas are not new unless they come from a place where we are not aware of them. Because if you are aware of it, other people are aware of it, too.
Kajikawa: That’s right. “Why now? That’s all that comes out. In everyday life. “It’s not something that happens everywhere.
Utsunomiya: But if you do that, the scene becomes more and more depressing…
Miki: That’s when you say “wonderful”.
Utsunomiya: “Wonderful”. The end of the word should be raised a little.
Kajikawa: You say “wonderful” (laughs)?
Utsunomiya: It is necessary for zenschool masters.
Miki: That’s what zenschool masters need to master. There is a practice called “Peacock Myoo,” which is to never say anything negative about anything.
Kajikawa: “That’s great! I said. Kajikawa: “That’s great!” “You’ve found a good point! Kajikawa: “That’s great!
Miki: He says it naturally.
Utsunomiya: He doesn’t even show it on his face. It’s natural. No judgments.
Miki: There are only two kinds of things, “normal” and “wonderful. When things are normal, I just keep quiet. If it’s good, it’s “wonderful.
Kajikawa: Is it okay to say “wonderful” in such a way?
Miki: Yes.
Utsunomiya: It’s fine if everyone does.
●Mrs. Kajikawa’s thoughts on “the future of XX in Japan
Miki: I have one last question, what do you think of “○○ in Japan”?
Utsunomiya: It could be the future of Factory Art Museum Toyama, or something close to you.
Miki: You can talk about the future of zenschool or the future of zenschool Toyama.
Kajikawa: Well, after taking the zenschool course and building the museum, people with high antennas started to approach us. I’m hoping that it will become a place where people who have come here are active. If we separate it into “monozukuri” (manufacturing), non-monozukuri people will put up a barrier saying, “I’m not a monozukuri person,” so let’s make it in the Hokuriku area. I’d like to create a place from this museum where people can come and enjoy the sunny weather, even in this part of Hokuriku where the weather is not so good, as it has been raining for four days in a row. I’d like to create a place where people who come to the museum can be really active, so I’d like to invite everyone to visit the museum.
Utsunomiya: The museum will be open for a month, until the Golden Week holidays in May.
Miki: There will also be a philosophy café and a classical concert.
Utsunomiya: Is Facebook the main source of information?
Kajikawa: Facebook and the website.
Utsunomiya: What are the search keywords?
Kajikawa: The search keyword is “Factory Art Museum event information,” so it’s a long one.
Utsunomiya: “Fujita, Toyama”?
Kajikawa: “Fujita, Toyama” or “Fujita, Takaoka”.
Miki: Please search for “Fujita, Toyama” or “Fujita, Takaoka” and visit there. So, today we have Mr. Kajikawa, President of Fujita Corporation. Thank you very much.
Kajikawa: Yes, thank you very much.
